Will of the Gods and Battle Hunger

[zarthas]

If I am reading this correctly, these are ostensibly the same trait.

Will of the Gods
Whenever this model performs an Activation or Reaction roll on two or more dice, you may re-roll a single die.

vs.

Battle Hunger
Whenever a model with Battle Hunger makes an Activation or Reaction roll on two or more dice, you may increase the result of single die by 1. Apply this rule after rolling the dice

My probability math is a little rusty, but I don't think there's a huge difference between the two rolls.

The mechanics of this are very slightly different, but they really might be too similar to be worth having both.

I'm not sure what the point costs of these traits are, as neither of them are in the ASOBH Profile builder. Neither one appears in a profile in the ASOBH PDF.

[Andrea Sfiligoi]

They are indeed similar and meant to be two variations on the same idea.

They are not in the builder because they were a last minute addition. A playtester suggested them and I think they could be useful for low Q warbands -- there are not many other mechanics that affect the activation rolls.

Some rules will be used in supplements, but since more than one supplement will likely use them, it makes sense to have them in the core book -- most people (I hope) will use the core book and some of the supplements or campaigns.

[Bristlechin]

Hi,

They are very similar, yet different traits. I will give you a couple of examples to illustrate:

Imagine a model that has Quality 4+ and the Battle Hunger trait. In terms of any quality rolls, the model is better than a Quality 4+ model but worse than a Quality 3+ model.

Now, a model that has Quality 4+ and the Will of the Gods trait is a different type of animal. The model is better than a Quality 4+ model but relative to a Quality 3+ model, it has a greater chance to have all failures but also all successes, when making quality rolls on 2 or more dice. Hence, there is greater variance associated with the outcome.

I created Battle Hunger as a racial trait for my orcs, because orcs with combat 3 and quality 4+ alone seemed to weak to me (I come from a warhammer fantasy battles background). Battle hunger makes them closer, yet worse than a quality 3+, which reflects their somewhat undisciplined nature (think Animosity from WFB, if you are familiar with that game).

Will of the Gods was created as I was trying to map the Cult of the Possessed warband from Mordheim to SOBH. Since it increases the chance of multiple failures and multiple successes, it has a very chaotic feel to it.

If you need exact probability distributions, I can send you some. The reason for the existence of these two traits is that otherwise most models are going to be quality 3+ or 4+, without much variety, and I think people will enjoy variety in quality rolls.

Best

Bristlechin

[zarthas]

I do understand the somewhat subtle probability that makes Battle Hunger slightly better for a Higher (4+) Quality model as opposed to Will of the Gods or Drilled.

The only gripe I have is that we now have three traits that do very similar things, and it might be difficult to pick which one is best for a given profile.

Drilled: +1 to any one die on activation.
Battle Hunger: +1 to any one die on activation or reaction when rolling two or more.
Will of the Gods: Re-roll one die when rolling two or more.

The distinction between Drilled and the other two traits is a little more clear-cut to me. Drilled troops activate more reliably but might not get as wild or bloodthirsty. I do prefer the "Battle Hunger" mechanic to the "Will of the Gods", as like you say, it would give a slight amount of beef to your rabble masses.

I understand that it is slightly mechanically different, I guess my complaint was really from a "Flavor" perspective. The difference seems a bit too fiddly to me, but I get that there is a gameplay niche for it. Its just hard to imagine building Battle Hunger vs Will of the Gods into a profile from anything but a mechanical perspective.

I do support any trait or rule that makes the High-Quality (4-5) models more usable, as it seems like the new Reactions mechanics punishes the High-Quality models twice, making them an even larger liability. I definitely see the need for traits that level the playing field a bit for these models.

Maybe I'm just being a naysayer. I haven't playtested with Will of the Gods or Battle Hunger.

Its also possible that I'm attempting to think too much along the lines of non-Advanced Song of Blades and Heroes. I suppose the Advanced version is the place to be fiddly.

Maybe its just that the phrase Battle Hunger didn't make sense to me at first. Would "Frenzied", "Bloodlust", or "Bloodthirsty" make sense to people as right-brained as me?