Suggested/Missing Profiles

[Andrea Sfiligoi]

If you need more profiles for HaF, especially in the generic dwarves rosters (i.e., dwarves that are not represented by the figures produced by Ganesha Games), please request them here.

You too can use the ASOBH Beta builder on: http://www.ganeshagames.net/extra_info_pages.php?pages_id=17&osCsid=944k02qre86ndfmv8r7120uch0

Please mention if you see anything wrong with the builder. Ray (the guy who does our builder) is working on collapsible sub-categories of traits, so the builder becomes smaller and traits within a category (e.g. spells) can be collapsed if you don't need them.

[Jcrozier]

One suggestion from me: would it be possible to vary the orc/goblin roster more from Fightin' Fungi? The Discipline Masters are great additions, but given the huge range of orcish models on the market, I wonder if it might be possible to reduce the duplication in the two lists - so that those with both books have a wider range of pre-generated profiles to choose from. Those in this book could showcase some of the Hammer and Forge traits a bit more. Also, much of the attraction of the rosters is to show what can be achieved with the deceptively simple SoBH profile.

Here are a few suggestions:

Orc Chieftain - Personality
Points:90 Quality:3 Combat:4
Dashing, Expert Block, Lead from the Front (L, Long Reach, P)

Goblin Scout
Points:32 Quality:4 Combat:2
Backstab, Short Bow (W), Stealth

Goblin Fungus-Eater
Points:33 Quality:4 Combat:3
Ball-and-Chain (W), Fearless

Orc Guard
Points:54 Quality:3 Combat:4
Bonded, Heavily Armored, Rare (4)
NB - as it stands, none of the book profiles have the Bonded trait.

Half-Orc Bully
Points:26 Quality:4 Combat:3
Coward, Opportunistic

Half-Orc Assassin - Personality
Points:72 Quality:3 Combat:3
Assassin (P), Coward, Short Bow (W), Stealth

Orcish Dire-Wolf Rider - Personality
Points:72 Quality:4 Combat:4
Greedy, Long Move, Savage (P), Savage Mount, Short Bow (W)
NB: Savage Mount also seems to be missing from the rosters at the moment

Goblin Wolf Rider
Points:56 Quality:4 Combat:3
Greedy, Long Move, Mounted, Quick, Short Bow (W)

Orc Archer
Points:30 Quality:4 Combat:3
Short Bow (W)

Great Orc Archer
Points:33 Quality:4 Combat:3
Longbow (W)

Orc Tribesman
Points:30 Quality:4 Combat:3
Dashing, Javelin

Orc Fungus-Eater
Points:41 Quality:4 Combat:4
Ball-and-Chain (W), Fearless
(I'm thinking specifically of the aged model at the middle and bottom of this page here, but I'm sure there are other similarly armed orcs out there!)

Anyway, these are just a few suggestions, to add variety and to utilise some very common types of miniatures (I think many people will have more orc bowmen/longbowmen than crossbowmen, for example).

[Andrea Sfiligoi]

good suggestion, I'm taking these profiles in but I guess some repetition is unavoidable. After all we are in roughly the same area of the world

[Jcrozier]

My personal preference - and I realise that I may be completely alone here! - would be for a note at the top of the roster saying something like "for additional orc and goblin profiles, see the rosters in Fightin' Fungi and future supplements". Will there be rosters in ASOBH itself too? It would be nice to have a huge swathe of options for each race:
- and an incentive for buying all the books!

I should say that I really like the FF orcish roster, which has lots of nice profiles that showcase the engine's versatility and give a lot of flavour (e.g. the hard-hitting but craven orc mercenary). But I also really like the sheer breadth of Hammer and Forge's generic dwarf list, which gives you all kinds of options - and will prove very useful in filling remaining spaces in points allocations ("Hmm - well, that means I can afford a veteran crossbowman ..."). It would be great if each supplement broadened the range for each of the races involved, so that you can find suitable profiles for all kinds of models if you look across the range.

I take your point about the necessity of repetition - and of course there's the space issue too; I realise that I'm making points about orcs in a book about dwarves! To play devil's advocate, though, I'd say that there's no reason why a region infested by orcs might not have as many types of orcish soldier as there were types of human soldier in (say) the wars of the Italian city states. And I think that point is particularly true of leaders. I'd expect the leaders of orcish bands to be extremely diverse: cunning old veterans, bloodthirsty brutes, crafty lead-from-the-back types, wicked sorcerers, cruel but efficient captains and grim champions. This sort of thing:

Orc Veteran Leader - Personality
Points:84 Quality:3 Combat:3
Danger Sense, Leader (L, Opportunistic, P), Veteran Group Fighter (P)

Orc Brigand Chief - Personality
Points:106 Quality:3 Combat:4
Composite Bow (W), Fire into Melee, Forester, Good Shot, Leader (L, P)
(Will the Evil trait not make it into ASoB? It's a great rule, as it gives a lot of flavour; I'd use that in preference to Fire into Melee here.)

Orc Captain - Personality
Points:86 Quality:3 Combat:4
Expert Block, Leader (L, P), Steadfast

Orc Champion - Personality
Points:110 Quality:3 Combat:4
Heavy Weapon, Hero (P), Inspiring Presence (L, P), Savage (P)

Again, just top-of-the-head suggestions, although I have used something very much like the brigand chief in a few games. One of the most exciting things about ASOBH, for me, is the new range of leadership options, so it would be great to see those showcased as much as possible. Games, obviously, play very differently with different leaders. I'm imagining a warband largely composed of Orc Rabble, with a Discipline Master, a couple of stauncher fighters and a formidable shooter (like the Brigand Chief!) as a leader. That would play very differently from one led by a lead-from-the-front or inspiring leader - especially if the Evil rule were in play (hapless Rabble minions shot down by their cold-hearted leader as he uses them to anchor his targets ...).

[Andrea Sfiligoi]

I added these profiles too since Orcs were running into a new page anyway.

Yes I want as much variety as possible, and in facts the narrative campaigns I'll publish will use a mix of book profiles and new profiles, to add to the overall variety.

Re: Evil. we can reintroduce it but maybe rename it, I see lots of people are assigning it to all figures whom they see as "morally evil" and not taking into account the mechanics. The way I'm doing traits now, is to break down the mechanics into as small as possible building bricks, to increase modularity. There are still a few rules that have more than one game effect, and that's unavoidable.

[Jcrozier]

You could maybe call it Callous (and then drop the more "alignment"-related aspects involving paladins and sacred ground and so on). Would a Callous Leader still kill fleeing minions? Quite possibly - that's quite a nice aspect of the rules, though I don't recall it ever coming up in a game. Perhaps that could be worked into a different, leader-specific trait.

The campaigns sound terrific!

One more thought on the orc profiles (sorry, I know it's verging on off topic!). If there's space, you could add a few non-personality trolls (troll brats/whelps, trollwives, other types of trolls) to allow players to run an all-troll warband. A brood of troll whelps could have Gang, for example, and perhaps Sling to represent hurled rocks. Maybe something like this?

Troll Brat
Points:27 Quality:4 Combat:2
Big, Gang, Oblivious to Danger, Sling (W)
Here, the Sling trait represents hurled rocks.

It's a slightly unusual profile, as the Big rule makes them atypically powerful for Gang members in combat, but highly vulnerable to shooting - and the Oblivious to Danger (clumsy and curious) trait exacerbates this.

Now - and again, this may be stuff for a Song of Cave and Bridge book - you could also add a Trollwife profile with a Protective trait - something like this:

"Characters with the Protective trait have designated charges (offspring, for example, or people they have sworn to guard). When one of these charges is in combat, the Protective character activates like a Hero (with one automatic success) and must move towards the attacker to engage in combat. If one or more of the charges is killed, the Protective character must pursue the killer using this enhanced activation until the killer has been routed or slain. This is only overridden if another character attacks a living charge, in which case the Protective character will act to protect that charge. Protective models gain the Savage trait against any characters who are attacking or have attacked their designated charges."

Again, it may be beyond the scope of this book (and will certainly need refining!), but I could see applications in bears and bearwolves with cubs and dragons with hatchlings as well. I could also see it working with knights sworn to protect kings or princesses.

[Andrea Sfiligoi]

Yes to troll whelps.

I think we have a Protect ability in SAM that works something like that, but it's been years since I used it.